New Schaaf tools

[Jlangston]

As a new carver, but longtime woodworker, I was looking for some new tools,to start with some relief carving. I bought a 10 chisel/gouge set on Amazon of Schaaf tools. I am very impressed so far with the quality! The are Pfeil look alikes, and feel very good in the hands. The steel seems very good, but I cannot attest to how long it holds an edge yet. They are quite beautiful as well. For $100, I think they are a steal. Drawback...they only offer the 10 tool set. I emailed them, and they indicated they are brand new and will offer more tools at a later date.

anyone else have a go with these?

[BobD]

Thanks for the heads up. I hadn't seen those yet. I've requested a sample to review in the magazine.

Best Regards,
Bob Duncan
Technical Editor, Woodworking/DIY

[pallin]

There are many examples of "look alike" products entering a successful market. Why not take advantage of the years of product development of the established leader? To sell quality tools for a fraction of the leader's price requires cutting corners. For carving tools this shows up as tiny, but important differences in shape, metal thickness, etc. It is not just the edge-holding quality. If the wings of a v-tool are not the same thickness, it can never be properly sharpened. Inevitably you get what you pay for.

[Brian T]

Steel? Only time will tell. Particularly when you get what you pay for. Narex skews and Samona spokeshaves were my 2 all-time bargains.

Sets vs open stock? I've been in the open stock camp from almost the beginning.
The first "group" of Pfeil gouges got me a 12/8 that might get used once a year, if that.

Those people must have a lot of confidence to stand up with the few(?) really established qualities.
Galileo is reported to have said: " Never refuse an old wine or a new idea."

[fiddlesticks]

Pallin,

I'm with you as far as carving tools, most tools really, go. Buy once, cry once.

My beef with most low end carving tools I've seen is they usually put enough steel in one tool to make at least two tools. Thick tools may look to the novice as a good value because they look sturdy and well made. If the steel is good, well then you just have a tool that is thicker than it should be. That can be fixed with some time at the belt sander after you know what should go and what should stay. The worst of both worlds is that the tool is thick and the steel is crap and the manufacturer knew this and that is why they went with such thick steel.

Of the current brands Pfeil, Stubai, Dastra and some Henry Taylor have thinner steel. Ashley Iles and some Two Cherries are thicker than they should be.

Schaaf, I don't know. They look to be a Total Pfeil knock off, but doubtful they will approach the quality at 1/5 to 1/6 of the Pfeil price. Lots of good ratings on Amazon, but not enough 3 and 4 stars for me to feel they are all legit. They come with a 100% guarantee and if you got them from Amazon, should be an easy return if they don't fit the bill.

I for one do like the idea of a beginner set of 5 to 10 tools, but would choose to get that set based on the opinion of an established carver that does the sort of carving you are interested in. Most pro carvers will gladly answer an email about what would be a good starter set when it comes politely from a new carving prospect. Ask three pros doing the same type of carving and those tools will differ, but at least you'll know the sets are ones that will work. If you don't have a few gouges you have no idea of what you might need. Three at a minimum give you a basis for wider, narrower, flatter, curvier, etc.

[woodburner807]

Thanks for posting and let us know how they hold an edge. I have a few "Power Grip" cheap chisels that I use a lot...Amazon deal.

[tbox61]

When I started carving in 1997, I too was an experienced wood worker. I am the poster boy for buying off brand, 'bargain' tools. I really hope these work out for you, but as someone who spent a lot of money on those 'bargain' tools, I would have been better off spending just a bit more for FlexCut, Pfeil, or other name brand tools. My learning curve would have not been as steep as I figured out what it was like to carve wood when you had a quality, really sharp tool, instead of something that made you scratch your head at times!

Good luck with them!

[BobD]

I'm in the process of scheduling an interview with someone from the company next week... so... let me know what questions you have! I really like the comments on what other people have seen wrong with other tools (variations in the thickness of the wings of a V-tool, for example). Personally, I like the hand feel of my Ashley Iles, but I've got my share of Pfeil, Two Cherries, Kirschen, and even a Stubai or two, as well as Ramelson palm tools.

Best Regards,
Bob Duncan
Technical Editor, Woodworking/DIY

[pallin]

There are factors that cannot be determined by just looking at the tools. For example the tang length inside the handle, and the choice of wood for the handle itself. These could be critical to a carver who plans to use a mallet. A beginner might assume a ferrule on the handle would prevent splitting, and not realize that most Pfeil gouges have an internal ferrule.

I do not hold to the "one brand is best" philosophy. Although I have a lot of Pfeil tools, my favorite is a Herring Brothers fishtail gouge. It is not shiny. The handle is stained and worn. But it cuts wood beautifully.

[fiddlesticks]

BobD, ask them if they offer individual tools and what ranges they cover - bent, long bent, short bent, fishtail - long pod, short pod, back bent and so on. Ask if they will send you a couple to pull apart and inspect. Would be interesting to see how they are put together.

[pallin]

In the first post it was stated that this company offers only the 10-tool set for $100, so the question of "open stock" and range of profiles is moot.

So, I went to a website to actually see the set. It's 12 gouges - mostly deep profiles (#7 to #9), one V (#12-6mm), one skew, one flat chisel. The widths are mostly 10mm, but a couple are 20mm. What's missing? I use mostly #2 and #3 gouges. I prefer fishtails.

[YME]

Hi all,

I have tools from many of the brands mentioned by previous posters and bought a set of the tools from Schaaf. I have been carving with them for some time now and have found them to be great

tools. Any new tools require some shaping and sharpening to suit the carver and these are no exception but it isn't difficult and the edges have held up extremely well. I like my set so well I have ordered more tools from the company and they have given me great service.

While a lot of carvers recommend just buying a few tools instead of a set to start with, how is a beginner supposed to know which tools they will or won't use initially? buying a general set at least provides a variety to try and can be added to later as the work requires. You may end up with a tool that you don't use very often but at the cost of the Schaaf set you can well afford to have an extra or two. Look at it this way, for cost of the four of the better known brands you can have a set of a dozen good tools and a tool roll. The tool set profiles match up pretty well with the better known brands. Before I bought I check out the reviews and to be honest, I think these tools are among the best I have ever owned. Be sure and go to the website and sign up and you can get 10% off your first purchase which makes the set even sweeter.

[Butch_Speer]

Hi all,

I have tools from many of the brands mentioned by previous posters and bought a set of the tools from Schaaf. I have been carving with them for some time now and have found them to be great

tools. Any new tools require some shaping and sharpening to suit the carver and these are no exception but it isn't difficult and the edges have held up extremely well. I like my set so well I have ordered more tools from the company and they have given me great service.

While a lot of carvers recommend just buying a few tools instead of a set to start with, how is a beginner supposed to know which tools they will or won't use initially? buying a general set at least provides a variety to try and can be added to later as the work requires. You may end up with a tool that you don't use very often but at the cost of the Schaaf set you can well afford to have an extra or two. Look at it this way, for cost of the four of the better known brands you can have a set of a dozen good tools and a tool roll. The tool set profiles match up pretty well with the better known brands. Before I bought I check out the reviews and to be honest, I think these tools are among the best I have ever owned. Be sure and go to the website and sign up and you can get 10% off your first purchase which makes the set even sweeter.

It's nice to see some one with something to say that has actually used the tools. Bad mouthing a product you've never used doesn't make much sense.

[BobD]

I'm glad someone else has tried out the tools. I'm planning a review in an upcoming issue of WcI, and I had a similar experience. The quality of these tools is surprisingly good. I'm still working with the company and have mentioned that folks are looking for more fishtail tools. They're looking at putting together some smaller sets of tools and moving into palm tools as well. I'm really excited about these tools!

Best Regards,
Bob Duncan
Technical Editor, Woodworking/DIY

[Brian T]

You could say the same thing about me and Narex skews and Samona spokeshaves. Daily drivers and I'm 100% satisfied.
I'd like to try a couple of the Schaaf 20mm gouges.